raincole
Yes, this is why I emphasized on "how people exactly do these".

This person (below) does a pretty deep dive into direct modeling, including setting up the workspace and shortcuts.

The link is to a playlist, so skip ahead a couple of videos to get to the actual setup (they start with how to download and install Houdini):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNkeQlT26R8&list=PLjZkvPsldTW86KegvL6c8WP47K4pPuxNL [www.youtube.com]

alexeyvanzhula1984

Tser

alexeyvanzhula1984
Everyone who says that modeling is done in Houdini doesn't mention that it's challenging and time-consuming. Houdini lacks many fundamental tools for proper modeling. Simply moving points is already a pain, and it's the most crucial operation in modeling. I won't even mention proper tools for connecting components or the responsiveness of the tools, etc. These are just a small fraction of the drawbacks that prevent "normal" modeling. Of course, if you revel in nodes and the unhurried structuring of them into containers, you can model in this way. But we need to call things by their names. Modeling in Houdini is slow and uncomfortable, regardless of how you've set up hotkeys and marking menus and even your own workflow.

For me, it's no harder than modeling in Maya, certainly not slow and uncomfortable, I was modeling in Maya for many years, I would still be modeling in Maya if Houdini didn't do the job. I personally love the degree of depth that the Houdini sops give.
T.

I'm not talking about the advantages of Houdini. Houdini's data handling is top-notch. But I will never believe that modeling in Houdini is comparable to Maya. I'll ask the first things that come to mind:

1. Don't you notice viewport glitches?
2. Haven't you noticed that initiating tools makes Houdini's viewport flicker?
3. Do you actually find it convenient to move points as implemented in Maya with manipulators and especially in Tweak mode? I know that Houdini has Tweak mode, but it's so pitiful.
4. How about simply moving the pivot? Is it really as convenient as in Maya with the 'D' key?
5. Do you really enjoy switching from one object to another? In Maya, you just need to click in the viewport.
6. Do you enjoy moving points of two objects simultaneously?
7. Do you like that ugly display of materials in the viewport?
8. Do you truly believe PolySplit and EdgeLoop can replace Multicut?
9. Do you have any analog to the Connect tool, which simply connects selected components?
10. Can TopoBuild be compared to QuadDraw?
11. Are you familiar with viewport crashes?
12. Do you know the feeling of having an open error log window in the bottom right corner?

This is just what came to mind. The main reason there aren't direct modeling videos in Houdini is that it's genuinely inconvenient and time-consuming. And the few videos that do exist are insufficient.

Sorry to here that your system is causing glitches or flickering with Houdini, I don't have these, Houdini is rock solid and stable, if you want to move the pivot just press the "insert" key.
T.

Hi,

for quickly moving a pivot there‘s a „volatile pivot“, I keymapped it to D

I actually like Houdini’s Modeling tools and I use Blender Daily and used Maya a few years. But the Modeler Addon really is a nice decision.

Houdini has extremely fast selection speeds, a construction plane I use all the time, very powerful snapping and alignment options, very useful deformer and of course nodes. I often use edit nodes to try out things or use the knife for non destructively creating folds on a sofa.

But, still Houdini in general feels very indirect, at times clunky and the viewport is not great, especially in Lops.

Nuke for example has hotkeys in nodes, like t for transform, g for grade and I don’t have to set them. There’s to much typing/node searching in general.
Also if you apply “power hungry” nodes like polyreduce Houdini tends to freeze until he’s finished calculating. For this reason I often make adjustments and wire the node afterwards, so I don’t need to wait until he reacts.

And with converted Cad Models cleaning and organizing in Houdini is not very good, I always use Blender for that. Blender is faster for renaming, changing hierarchy, grouping, splitting, removing stuff that is not visible, applying and replacing materials ect.

For certain Jobs I don’t even try to force Houdini anymore and just use Blender. But these two really complement each other well.

Best
C

CV
for quickly moving a pivot there‘s a „volatile pivot“, I keymapped it to D

I meant that in Houdini there are many ways to change the pivot, and it's all very confusing, while in Maya it's just the D key. I know about volatile pivot.

Tser
Sorry to here that your system is causing glitches or flickering with Houdini, I don't have these
T.

No, you have. Every person will periodically observe them if they model in Houdini with stock tools.
https://youtu.be/uMQ9ga9gIWo [youtu.be]

Will Houdini 20 lanches this year?

alexeyvanzhula1984
No, you have. Every person will periodically observe them if they model in Houdini with stock tools.
https://youtu.be/uMQ9ga9gIWo [youtu.be]

I don't see this on my system (the 4K version will take a few minutes to catch up, but the lack of flickering is evident even at 360p).

eikonoklastes

alexeyvanzhula1984
No, you have. Every person will periodically observe them if they model in Houdini with stock tools.
https://youtu.be/uMQ9ga9gIWo [youtu.be]

I don't see this on my system (the 4K version will take a few minutes to catch up, but the lack of flickering is evident even at 360p).

I see how slowly your edges are being deleted. Check out the end of my video again. It's faster there. Even though I have a weak laptop.
If you want to 100% see the flickering, activate the polygon selection mode, select several polygons, then switch to edge mode and delete the loop. I understand that some might console themselves with the idea that everything is fine in Houdini. But this doesn’t align with reality.

The fact that I have a outdated laptop with a weak GPU doesn’t negate the fact that I have no lags or flickers in Modeler mode at all. This means that the native tools could already be better. At the same time, everything works smoothly in Maya on the same PC. There are absolutely no flickers there.

I won't argue anymore. It's pointless.

eikonoklastes

alexeyvanzhula1984
No, you have. Every person will periodically observe them if they model in Houdini with stock tools.
https://youtu.be/uMQ9ga9gIWo [youtu.be]

I don't see this on my system (the 4K version will take a few minutes to catch up, but the lack of flickering is evident even at 360p).

It took you 34s to select few loops on a sphere and you don’t see the problem?

hMonkey
It took you 34s to select few loops on a sphere and you don’t see the problem?

Are you being deliberately facetious, because it does seem that way. I can select loops and delete them in less than 34 seconds if that's your burning issue with the video that was made to demonstrate an entirely different thing.

alexeyvanzhula1984
Everyone who says that modeling is done in Houdini doesn't mention that it's challenging and time-consuming. Houdini lacks many fundamental tools for proper modeling. Simply moving points is already a pain, and it's the most crucial operation in modeling. I won't even mention proper tools for connecting components or the responsiveness of the tools, etc. These are just a small fraction of the drawbacks that prevent "normal" modeling. Of course, if you revel in nodes and the unhurried structuring of them into containers, you can model in this way. But we need to call things by their names. Modeling in Houdini is slow and uncomfortable, regardless of how you've set up hotkeys and marking menus and even your own workflow.

Not to mention the terrible/imprecise viewport navigation and screwed up priority (navigation as a tool).

You can notice it here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHw5STAlRgw [www.youtube.com]

eikonoklastes

raincole
Yes, this is why I emphasized on "how people exactly do these".

This person (below) does a pretty deep dive into direct modeling, including setting up the workspace and shortcuts.

The link is to a playlist, so skip ahead a couple of videos to get to the actual setup (they start with how to download and install Houdini):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNkeQlT26R8&list=PLjZkvPsldTW86KegvL6c8WP47K4pPuxNL [www.youtube.com]

Thanks, I'll take a look. Perhaps it would change my opinion on Houdini's direct modeling process.

My current opinion is that when it comes to modeling, SideFX should really learn one or two things from people like Alexey Vanzhula.

alexeyvanzhula1984
If you want to 100% see the flickering, activate the polygon selection mode, select several polygons, then switch to edge mode and delete the loop.

In the video, I actually do (accidentally) select all the polygons first, then switch to edges, and that didn't produce the flicker.

alexeyvanzhula1984
I see how slowly your edges are being deleted.

For context, I don't think anyone is saying that Houdini's modeling toolset is a world-beater, they're just saying that they're good enough to use as a daily-driver for a good chunk of modeling, without having to deal with an external app. The common perception has been that Houdini is utterly useless at modeling, and that is just objectively not true. Yes, you can get a better modeling experience in other apps, but if your preference is to stay with Houdini, then you can get modeling work done reasonably efficiently with it too.

For me, personally, the fraction-of-a-second-longer-than-instant that it takes to select or delete edges on a dense mesh is not a huge deal.

I do get your position though - they could be optimised to work better, and I'm all for that, so hopefully there are improvements there.

eikonoklastes

hMonkey
It took you 34s to select few loops on a sphere and you don’t see the problem?

Are you being deliberately facetious, because it does seem that way. I can select loops and delete it in less than 34 seconds if that's your burning issue with the video that was made to demonstrate an entirely different thing.

No, just stating that viewport has a lot of issues, and depending on platform they are more or less prominent, but they do exist. Just because you were fortunate enough not to hit that issue doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist, and the "fortunate" thing is another issue...

raincole

eikonoklastes

raincole
Yes, this is why I emphasized on "how people exactly do these".

This person (below) does a pretty deep dive into direct modeling, including setting up the workspace and shortcuts.

The link is to a playlist, so skip ahead a couple of videos to get to the actual setup (they start with how to download and install Houdini):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNkeQlT26R8&list=PLjZkvPsldTW86KegvL6c8WP47K4pPuxNL [www.youtube.com]

Thanks, I'll take a look. Perhaps it would change my opinion on Houdini's direct modeling process.

My current opinion is that when it comes to modeling, SideFX should really learn one or two things from people like Alexey Vanzhula.

OOBE?

where is the sneak peak

hMonkey
Not to mention the terrible/imprecise viewport navigation and screwed up priority (navigation as a tool).

Can you expand on this? I haven't experienced any imprecision with viewport navigation, and I don't understand what you mean by "screwed up priority (navigation as a tool)."

hMonkey
You can notice it here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHw5STAlRgw [www.youtube.com]

Where? It's an 83 minute video.

eikonoklastes

hMonkey
Not to mention the terrible/imprecise viewport navigation and screwed up priority (navigation as a tool).

Can you expand on this? I haven't experienced any imprecision with viewport navigation, and I don't understand what you mean by "screwed up priority (navigation as a tool)."

hMonkey
You can notice it here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHw5STAlRgw [www.youtube.com]

Where? It's an 83 minute video.

\
I don’t remember which part, but it’s peppered through out the video, basically pivot around cursor is imprecise and wonky at times, and occasionally you have to wrestle with pan and zoom, all that falls under the viewport issues category.

About modeling.

Houdini is more focused on big studios needs, don't think current development plans could fit abandoned modeling tools improvements. Besides, it impossible to compete with Modo or Maya in this area currently. Team is heading different direction currently with all the USD improvements, character stuff, which is kinda cool.

The only hope are labs team, which could come up with some additional tools..

As for now, if you want to be more productive - grab one more weapon into your arsenal, it's free - Blender. Made for people : D

Pavel Breiva
About modeling.

Houdini is more focused on big studios needs, don't think current development plans could fit abandoned modeling tools improvements. Besides, it impossible to compete with Modo or Maya in this area currently. Team is heading different direction currently with all the USD improvements, character stuff, which is kinda cool.

The only hope are labs team, which could come up with some additional tools..

As for now, if you want to be more productive - grab one more weapon into your arsenal, it's free - Blender. Made for people : D

have you tried Modeler?