sylix: I have no idea what age of mine would satisfy you but I ensure you I'm enough old to ignore all personal tones . My post was a comment to your comment and I tried to clarify one thing. Houdini like almost any other high-end application is not a stand-alone tool:

- it needs to be pipe into a whole environment,
- it's designed to be pipe-in,
- it's sell to customers who owns these pipes

SideFx didn't decide which OS is used in these pipelines. Customers did.
What cpb said was just it: SESI can't effort to port Houdini for 50 freelance from all of the world. Rest of their clients works in mixed environ. anyway.

And finally I haven't meant (and said either) that I'm guru or Mac is a toy. Actually I use of of them according to my needs WinXP/Lin/OSX. I said I don't believe that any OSX based freelance is planning to buy Houdini. Houdini is not a freelance tool. If I had to make a choice of one and only one computer/package/OS this wouldn't be Lin/Houdini. It just doesn't fit to this condition.

cheers,
sy.

digitallysane: I would love to work only on OS as comfortable as OSX.
Unfortunately there are number of reasons I can't. Houdini is only one of them.
In perfect world Houdini could be accessible even on PS3. And this would be perfect. I agree!

SYmek
In perfect world Houdini could be accessible even on PS3. And this would be perfect.

I vote for Wii actually. The Wiimote is a perfect input device for CHOPs. :wink:

Dragos

OSX is in the middle, being a desktop Unix which seems to be filled with all the features I need for production.

I'm not sure if you are not overestimating OSX in this respect. Every time I thought I work on linux distro while touching OSX, I was wrong… and Shake never worked on OSX as good as on Linux.

(One friend of mine, pipeline engineer, told me once about OSX: this computer is great!… as long as it doesn't have to communicate with others. You should see his face then…)

SYmek
sylix: I have no idea what age of mine would satisfy you but I ensure you I'm enough old to ignore all personal tones

“Put down thy sword, Peter, for he who raises the sword shall perish by it.”

Then watch your words carefully and don't start those “personal tones” saying “It seems that you want OSX port to play with it, not to work on it.” and “These are Modo/Lightwave users and they are not interested in Houdini at all.” if you don't like the strike back. :-)

I use modo as a part of my pipeline and I see nothing shameful about it. ;-) I hope this is the period?

As to the subject: I don't feel like seeing Houdini on PS3, Wii, XBox, ZXSpectrum, Amiga and whatever. I know that's for “haha”, but seriously - I'm not saying let's port it on all plats just to port it.

In OSX there's now enough of pro software to do your job: Shake, Nuke, Maya, Cinema 4D, modo, Lightwave, ZBrush, Adobe CS3, Painter X, Maxwell Render, Real Flow, Final Cut Studio, VRAYforC4D (in faraway future)… even Adium, Luxor and Call of Duty, so that you can do what you need in one env. Why do people need a renderer for their app personally if they could just export it to another one and render it there?

Why should I go to Lin or Win to complete my work if I could do it right here? Without searching for a comp with one of those systems or waiting till I go to my office if I all of a sudden don't have needed OS here at hand?

We have three operating systems that can be used in production, combined or standalone (as you like): Microsoft Windows, Apple Mac OS X, Linux distribs - why not to make ports of a pro soft for these systems? We now have Lin, Win - why not OSX?

I'm not saying that if there's something too small in the pipeline so let's port it as well - I'm saying that Houdini - is the app where I do one of the major parts of my job… where's the serious reason for I don't need it natively in OSX?

For example, personally me, don't need 3ds max port for OSX even if it has Vray, I'd say - I need VRay for OSX; and those 3ds max guys won't like it, I suppose, to port it to Lin or OSX, for they can do all they need in Win - model, texture, render, postprocess, composite, play Counter Strike. And that's OK!

I don't have it and I have to switch. I wouldn't worry about switching if my workflow is split among different apps in different OSs. I don't have it here, but can get it there; don't have it there, but elsewhere it could be found - then I don't care that I don't have it under some certain OS. But my workflow is kind of totally in OSX but for Houdini.

Best regards.

So unfortunately you're in this very uncomfortable situation of minors.

I'd like to see Houdini in OSX. All I said was that I understand why it's still not there.

best,
sy.

Oh, and I definitely didn't mean anything for Modo or Lightwave users. Sentence you quoted says what is says: Modo/Lightwave buyers set is exclusive with Houdini's one for most its part. There are exceptions though .

SYmek
So unfortunately you're in this very uncomfortable situation of minors.

I'd like to see Houdini in OSX. All I said was that I understand why it's still not there.

best,
sy.

Oh, and I definitely didn't mean anything for Modo or Lightwave users. Sentence you quoted says what is says: Modo/Lightwave buyers set is exclusive with Houdini's one for most its part. There are exceptions though .

I see your point of view.

I said I don't believe that any OSX based freelance is planning to buy Houdini. Houdini is not a freelance tool.

Houdini may be the best freelancer tool in my opinion. It is a complete package, with additional render licenses included. Every single cross-platform option is a given freedom to any individual or studio. I for one in my own business always like to have more than one option, so if some x company screws up i can switch over to the y company without messing up my business. It is not just about selling licenses on OSX platform, it is also about providing this freedom. Having the linux version is a relief, no matter what i am thankful for that.

as an aside;

the latest parallels beta (5120) runs the H9 beta, although there's major visual glitches (maya suffers the same problems).

setting the HOUDINI_OGL_SOFTWARE = 1 var fixes the glitches however. its slow, but its good enough to keep me learning houdini without rebooting.

H9 under bootcamp runs perfectly. this is on my shiny shiny new macbook pro with the nvidia gfx card.

I too wouldn't mind a native OSX version, but understand why its not a priority. Maybe once H9 settles down, the character tools and documentation become solid, and the hype machine really kicks in pushing houdini as the future of all 3d, they can attack the OSX market guns blazing.

a little off topic but definately highlights the lack-of-software point about linux, does anyone know of any credible audio production software made for linux?

I wish high-end audio programs would have caught on to linux like high-end graphics programs.

Currently that's the only thing keeping me in windows limbo

Check this out:

http://ardour.org/node [ardour.org]

I've never used it personally though.

cheers,
sy.

You can also try audacity (bit simple) and rezound ( http//rezound.sourceforge.net ). It seems Ardour is going to be released on OSX too so no need for linux (linux sucks big time anyway, it's free).

well, they compare it to Nuendo / Protools, and Pyramix, to make a claim like that they are either full-of-it, or there are some nice features / capabilities in there, I'm using Nuendo currently

It's been a while since I checked the linux audio scene, this certainly looks like the most comprehensive one I've seen yet, and looks like it's free/open source too.

I'll definitely check this out … thanks!

ok, sorry to change topic back to how great osx is …

There's plenty of linux audio software out there, much of it very good.
http://linux-sound.org/ [linux-sound.org]
http://www.linuxaudio.org/ [linuxaudio.org]

Yeah I've seen that website, much of that software looks useful for certain tasks, but I'm thinking more along the lines of a production ready package for use with high-end audio hardware (looks like RME hardware is the only company so far). I'm of course interested in this because of audio integration with Houdini. The fact that Audure is free should be very appealing for Houdini-audio with linux. PC/Mac apps of that calibure I've seen are usually commercial apps.

Audure seems to resemble what I'm used to with Pro-tools and Nuendo, but that's certainly the first I've seen of it's kind for Linux.

Macs are known for audio due to the domination of pro-tools in the industry, which I'm not too happy about since it's a completely closed and over-priced system (problem with a lot of mac solutions). I think audio studios could have much better file management and more stable production enviornments with linux.

Well it's a bit of the unix paradigm, one program does one thing and only one thing well. Use pipes and redirects to glue stuff together.

But…we are kind of hijacking this thread…and Andrew, you are saying ugly things about the most wonderful OS of them all, Mac OSX…bad, bad, bad!

yes sorry to hijack thread back to mac

seems as even though osx and linux are both unix based, they are polar opposites in terms of the user's interaction with the OS … and windows would be somewhere in the middle.

Linux allows you to configure the system / hardware however you choose, and apple in general wants to keep everything as a completly self-contained system (as well as market).

Not trying to say anything bad here but that usually leads to higher prices for the same performance, as well as less customization. Most would agree that building your own high-end linux system and hardware is WAY cheaper than buying everything apple, provided it does what you'd need it to do.

But there's also something to be said for actually having it work out of the box without having to do tons of your own personal R&D. For meeting the needs of a certain industry (like audio or graphic design) with which macs currently have a huge advantage over linux due to applications.

This isn't the case with CG graphics as of yet, I personally hope there remains at least a few reasons why CG pros would pick linux over a mac.

Andrew a little bit more about sound under linux, something for you to investigate

http//wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/ProAudioCommercialToLinuxSoftware

Intersting parts are the LADSPA stuff and the JACKkit.

Iirc there is a special distribution of SuSE ( http//jacklab.org/ ) and Debian ( http//www.64studio.com ) that are meant for audio.

thanks that's very useful. It also pretty much confirms what I was saying about mac vs linux (in this case with audio). More applications on the mac side, more configurability on the linux side.

A professional task can be approached both ways, and both ways have thier advantages and limitations. It's just a matter of linux catching up to the PC / Mac side in terms of applications I guess. Audure looks promising though.

….Rhino3D (NURBS modeller) is working on an OSX port.

http://community.irhino3d.com/ [community.irhino3d.com]

Regards

andrewlowell
yes sorry to hijack thread back to mac

seems as even though osx and linux are both unix based, they are polar opposites in terms of the user's interaction with the OS … and windows would be somewhere in the middle.

Linux allows you to configure the system / hardware however you choose, and apple in general wants to keep everything as a completly self-contained system (as well as market).

Not trying to say anything bad here but that usually leads to higher prices for the same performance, as well as less customization. Most would agree that building your own high-end linux system and hardware is WAY cheaper than buying everything apple, provided it does what you'd need it to do.

Actually, the Apple hardware is pretty darn competitive with what's out there, e.g. a Boxx PC. And the engineering of a Mac Pro is light years ahead of PC boxes. The Intel Mac Pro's are simply gorgeous. Add a drive in 4 minutes. Add RAM in 1.5 minutes. And they're quiet!

Now, however, add in the $ that you would have to pay a sysadmin to configure a linux kernel for you that works, and Linux suddenly gets very expensive. Now that's for a small shop. When the shop gets bigger, e.g. 50+ people, I think the tables turn again, as the sysadmin cost can be amortized over greater #'s of TDs.

OS X's gui is fabulous, except for one showstopper item: lack of a settable mouse focus policy. Underneath, I'm not a huge fan of the OS X flavor of Unix, but Apple has the .app thing much more cleanly handled than anyone else.

But there's also something to be said for actually having it work out of the box without having to do tons of your own personal R&D. For meeting the needs of a certain industry (like audio or graphic design) with which macs currently have a huge advantage over linux due to applications.

This isn't the case with CG graphics as of yet, I personally hope there remains at least a few reasons why CG pros would pick linux over a mac.