In SI I sometimes created a hair setup where I controlled the hair by strands that were controlled by less strands that might be controlled by even fewer strands. You can kind of stack strands on top of each-other. Very convenient in some situations.

At first sight the hair control seems a bit limited compared to ICE in Softimage.

So I was wondering it such a setup also possible in Houdini ?

You have to build the thing, just like in ICE. I guess you didn't used factory ICE hair interpolators for stacking. Everything is there in H, starting from basic math nodes, geometry queries and such. It can go without single line of code (that's first hand experience), while there are significant differences between ICE and Houdini, when it comes to methods for creating something hair - like. Also, definitively there is no such offer of streamlined solutions around, like it was in ICE times.

amm
You have to build the thing, just like in ICE. I guess you didn't used factory ICE hair interpolators for stacking. Everything is there in H, starting from basic math nodes, geometry queries and such. It can go without single line of code (that's first hand experience), while there are significant differences between ICE and Houdini, when it comes to methods for creating something hair - like. Also, definitively there is no such offer of streamlined solutions around, like it was in ICE times.

Building what exactly ? I found just using hairgenerate in serial are working very well no ?

BTW If we ever could get our hand on that … https://vimeo.com/301068099 [vimeo.com]

Yes, a Groombear, that's what I want for my birthday :-)

I've been fumbling with hair in Houdini, but so far it doesn't look very promising. The grooming tools out of the box are just too frustrating to work with, they look broken to me, sometimes the groom brushes simply refuse to work. And most of the time they make the hair end up on the wrong side of the surface.

I suspect I'll end up still grooming in Softimage something like Blender and import the guides.

How would you do that ? I looked into it, but couldn't figure how to control one guide groom with another.

I created 2 Guide Grooms, one from points and a denser one from skin.

Then I want to control the dense groom with the sparse one.

But I see a “Source Mode” where I'd expect I have to select a control groom to do that, but it's is greyed out. Wouldn't know how to enable it.
Also tried several nodes inside the groom SOP to plug in the sparse groom, but so far no luck. ( I presume it's a SOP, still getting used to the naming conventions in Houdini )

@toonafish After reading multiple posts of yours, I've come to think you're just talking non-sense. There are plenty of things to dislike about Houdini when coming from another package, especially from Softimage, but you don't seem to be around here to learn and maybe in the process improve the software with your constructive feedback.

Rants are fine, everyone knows it's part of our flawed human nature and have learned to ignore/bypass them to get to the core of the grievance/argument, but when you peel the rant away and there's nothing underneath it, it is, in my opinion, the moment when one should consider stopping peeling away and just move along.

Nota bene: I have nothing against you posting around here - I'm not for shutting people up, it would be against one of my core principles. However, most, if not all of your posts, still lack images/scene files, even after I've warned you it's not the best approach to get help.

I should do a soul-search/self-awareness checkup on my subroutines, because at first glance, replying to this thread seems somehow wrong and lacking in any kind of accomplishment (probably to be proven by your future posts), yet I feel a need to do it.

p.s. Just take the time to learn how Houdini's hair system works and see what “hairgen” at SOP level can do for you.
Hint: in Houdini's hair, everything's strands.

Huh ?! Enlighten me, what non-sense am I talking ?

I can only report my own experiences with Houdini, and they have been frustrating very often so far. But maybe it's my Dutch bluntness, and I should sugarcoat my frustration a bit more :-)

Your Dutch bluntness is cake compared to my Eastern-European potential bluntness, but let's take dick measuring in bluntness in private if necessary.

Take the time to learn a particular tool/workflow in Houdini and then, and ONLY then, complain about it. I've been guilty of this myself in the past, although I'm hoping that not very often since I was aware of the danger from the start, but I always posted an analysis, regardless of how good/accurate, of what I was experiencing, with proposed solutions, regardless of how bad/good they were.

There are a lot of things in Houdini right now that are a result of my RFEs, most people are not aware of, nor do I care to make everyone aware about it, just as they would not care, I'm sure. I'm very sure other people have had stronger influence on features regarding the industry Houdini is mostly used in, and as such I don't want to over-emphasize my role here, because it's not big, but at least it's detectable for a fine-tuned apparatus.

The way you approach this, is not going to get you anywhere. Other than maybe figuring out that Houdini is not for you and then moving along. Where you're at regarding this? Have you had enough of Houdini already?

OK, thanks for explaining the rules; happy feelings only, and mention any problems to no other than Support. Got it…

In the short time I've been trying to switch to Houdini I've reported my share of RFE's and ran into several confirmed bugs.
But I thought a forum like this could also be a perfect place get help as a newbie before wasting supports time. And sometimes I mention my real experiences in the flow of a “conversation”, so someone can point out that I might be using a wrong setting, never encountered that specific issue, or that some things always happen on a Wednesday :-) Wouldn't that be great ?

Food for thought ;-)

Still curious as to what nonsense I was talking though.

toonafish
OK, thanks for explaining the rules; happy feelings only, and mention any problems to no other than Support. Got it…

In the short time I've been trying to switch to Houdini I've reported my share of RFE's and ran into several confirmed bugs.
But I thought a forum like this could also be a perfect place get help as a newbie before wasting supports time. And sometimes I mention my real experiences in the flow of a “conversation”, so someone can point out that I might be using a wrong setting, never encountered that specific issue, or that some things always happen on a Wednesday :-) Wouldn't that be great ?

Food for thought ;-)

Still curious as to what nonsense I was talking though.

Well, let's start with the end - “Still curious as to what nonsense I was talking though.” How would you rate your Houdini's hair expertise on a scale of 1-10? The answer alone might not say anything, but coupled with your questions, I don't think it ranks very high. I don't think you master Houdini's hair system combined with its other tools very well. Hell, I don't do that either…

Do you think your brief tests and your failure to achieve what you wanted is evidence of Houdini's failings? I'm open to the idea (there are plenty around here thinking that I'm bent on proving just that), just show us how - by example from another package (if someone already discovered and implemented this) or by drawing/sketching, in images or words, your own workflow/ideas.

NNois

amm
You have to build the thing, just like in ICE. I guess you didn't used factory ICE hair interpolators for stacking. Everything is there in H, starting from basic math nodes, geometry queries and such. It can go without single line of code (that's first hand experience), while there are significant differences between ICE and Houdini, when it comes to methods for creating something hair - like. Also, definitively there is no such offer of streamlined solutions around, like it was in ICE times.

Building what exactly ? I found just using hairgenerate in serial are working very well no ?

BTW If we ever could get our hand on that … https://vimeo.com/301068099 [vimeo.com]

If I understood the original post, it's about something like… using the output of one Fur SOP as input of next Fur SOP. That is, stacking. This definitively won't work good (even if someone would get this to work) with something really really basic in options like H Fur SOP. But it's possible to build (and get a way faster, btw).
Other than that, sometime around H 14 I just stopped with any view-port interaction in H except rotating the camera, and any shelf tool as well, for personal mental sanity. In other words, I just don't care about their brushes, handles and else. Too much different than rest of 3d world when it comes to viewport interaction, while user base is miniature. Hard to learn, easy to forget. There are other things to do…

Have you tried to influence the toolset and workflows in Houdini amm? By publishing solutions for public analysis and followed by thorough RFEs?
You're a rather technically capable/adaptable user so if you didn't do that so far, it would be a shame, because you also have experience with what a 3d software package should look like from an “artistic” (in a “normal” world I shouldn't have to put artistic in quotes (in a normal world i shouldn't have to put normal in quotes)) as well as being aware of the technical demands that are present in various pipelines as well as Houdini single-artist chalanges.
The defeatist attitude i've detected on your side is rather disappointing to be honest. Either help sidefx and its unexperienced users get their bearing or you're wasting your time TBH. Knowing you, as a user, I know you could do so much more than that.

amm
… Too much different than rest of 3d world when it comes to viewport interaction…

You just forget blender ! ;-)

pickled
Have you tried to influence the toolset and workflows in Houdini amm? By publishing solutions for public analysis and followed by thorough RFEs?

As I said, it's possible to build one, what I'm talking is based on personal experience.
Such functionality is a bit exceptional, influenced by taste of artists, how and where you'll do it. That is, it has to be confirmed by end users first, *then* it comes to RFE-ing and such. There are dozens of scripts-plugins for Maya xGen able to something similar on xGen guides, no one is included in Maya releases.
Otherwise you'll have a few more nodes usable for robots, maybe, over a few thousands (I think)of already present in H.